Expat Ukraine Forum

News and Views => European Politics => Topic started by: David Rochlin on 03:34 25-Sep-2017

Title: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: David Rochlin on 03:34 25-Sep-2017
Angela Merkel's Party comes out best with about one third of votes.  But, they had 10% more last time.  Her Party is very much pro-Ukraine/anti-Russia, at least in comparison with the the Kremlin-based midget friendly Social democrats, who also lost 10%.   The story is that Germany's right got more votes, and the extreme right got into the legislature.   The extreme right is the Kremlin-based midget friendly and Russia financed. 
Merkel will coalition to keep her job.  And that coalition will be weaker.   But, the opposition is also fractured.   
The outcome is O.K. for Ukraine, assuming no surprises in forming a Government.   
The EU already extended sanctions and Merkel will not make noises about ending them, post election. 
http://www.dw.com/en/german-election-results-disappointing-victory-for-angela-merkel-as-cdu-sinks-nationalist-afd-surges/a-40666430
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: Paulenko on 11:46 25-Sep-2017
To be honest, I am surprised that Merkel has won a 4th term in office and by quite a big margin as well. She and her party are clearly very popular in Germany, certainly more popular than I thought. I would of thought her decision to let in all those refugees a couple of years ago with many of them not properly vetted, would of turned a lot of Germans against her. The problems the immigrants have caused in Germany since then have been numerous. But I guess her popularity among the German people has overridden that.

For Ukraine, it is clearly a positive event that Merkel has held on to power. Ukraine needs as many allies as possible right now.
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: frank1010 on 21:01 25-Sep-2017
The numerous problems due to the immigrants do not exist... This is an enemy scenario created by the extreme right in order to present themselves as the savior.... nevertheless it is scary that after Germanys history, this rightwing party got 13% of the votes... and most of these dumbass 13% explained their voting with a wish to show protest against the ruling parties... yeah of course you vote for the Nazis as a sign of protest. these voters have left their brain at the wardrobe before they went to the ballots.
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: AkMike on 08:14 27-Sep-2017
The numerous problems due to the immigrants do not exist...

Really?  ???  That's not what the news shows from many sources.

2016 only,

 https://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/16/opinion/can-germany-be-honest-about-its-refugee-problems.html?mcubz=0

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36148418

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-09-03/germanys-open-door-refugee-problems-12-months-on/7811116

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jan/09/germany-sex-attacks-cologne-immigration

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/649602/EXPOSED-Germany-migrants-crime-cant-deported

These as well as 2million more hits on a quick google search.
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: frank1010 on 09:53 27-Sep-2017
The number of links or sources determines the credibility of the statement that Germany has a refugee problem? a refugees in my opinion can never be a problem. The problem is the war stricken places where human rights are abused and which makes people escape... the problem is not the people trying to escape. all the refugees and migrants were declared a problem mostly by right wing parties and populists who tried to invent someting in order to win votes. according to them the problem is all these illegal criminals and Muslim terrorists, which shatter europe. The solution is blocking the borders, throw all illegal  migrants out immediately and stick to the pure blood of our nation..... The Nazis tried to tell Germans the same by the way. That is a problem in my opinion....
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: AkMike on 10:04 27-Sep-2017
 :D  No the problem seems to be that they aren't very nice people that seem bent on causing problems.  :D :D
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: David Rochlin on 10:46 27-Sep-2017
In some EU countries, there is a sensibility that there is free speech, despite that if you say the wrong thing about refugees, or even share a link with others, such communication can be breaking the law, just like in Russia.  And many people will be afraid or embarassed to say why life has changed in the largest urban areas,  in terms of crime and the freedom women have to go out at night with a sense of safety.   
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: julienp on 12:08 27-Sep-2017
:D  No the problem seems to be that they aren't very nice people that seem bent on causing problems.  :D :D
Like every single one of them ?
Germans must really be masochist to keep electing Merkel party after allowing a million migrant in a couple of years.
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: Reggie on 16:07 27-Sep-2017
Germans must really be masochist to keep electing Merkel party after allowing a million migrant in a couple of years.

She has large breasts.   

The Romans had the legend of the Capitoline Wolf; it was the founding myth of the city of Rome, in the 8th century BC. 

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/22/f3/b0/22f3b0a6531b4b612ed47fe72c24fc4c.jpg)

I've had a similar fantasy for a while; where I am Romulus and Cindy Crawford is the She-Wolf.

Merkel has that effect on Europe:

(https://somosmulheresreais.files.wordpress.com/2010/02/angelamerkel1.jpg)   

You can tell a lot about someone, just by how they eat a hot dog.

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Q8qa0EHr0jg/UNzRB-vEoxI/AAAAAAAAC5w/ACpgctMKyKU/s1600/smesna+slika+Angela-Merkel-2.jpg)
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: Carlusha on 16:21 27-Sep-2017

(https://somosmulheresreais.files.wordpress.com/2010/02/angelamerkel1.jpg)   



He from over the pond with small hands would have a problem here, methinks!  ::)
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: Reggie on 16:32 27-Sep-2017


I can't write anything to that without it going over the line ...  :D :D :D :D :D

Who said anything about using your hands?


 ;) :D :D :D :D
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: Carlusha on 16:48 27-Sep-2017

Who said anything about using your hands?


No one Reggie! It was a simple case of insinuation by forum! Does that make sense?  ::) :-\

Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: Reggie on 16:56 27-Sep-2017

Who said anything about using your hands?


No one Reggie! It was a simple case of insinuation by forum! Does that make sense?  ::) :-\

Yes it does.

💋
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: AkMike on 17:08 27-Sep-2017
julienp, No you're correct.. I was painting with a broad brush. I'm sure that some are good folks but it's usually the 'vocal minority' that gets attention. 

 But Frank1010's statement ," The numerous problems due to the immigrants do not exist..." is very flawed by a simple look at the news.
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: sosednik on 21:58 28-Sep-2017
Every large population has a fraction who are morally depraved and commit criminal acts.

The majority of German voters are well aware of conditions in their country, and did not become hysterical about an exaggerated threat.  Perhaps they benefit from not listening to compulsive liars like Steve Bannon.

Perhaps the majority of Germans show a moral maturity lacking in other countries.  Maybe they understand that the reason to do good is not that it is easy, or safe, or cost-free ... but because it is the right thing to do.

(https://i.pinimg.com/736x/c8/b3/60/c8b360b3f0c433607d8bc1b8c1fc2a4d--political-cartoons-political-satire.jpg)

(http://www.snopes.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/dr-seuss-adolf-the-wolf.jpg)
___________________________________

@AkMike:

I typed "Trump is the Kremlin-based midget's puppet" into google, and got:

Quote
About 1,140,000 results (0.97 seconds)

Is a large number of google hits evidence?
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: Reggie on 22:39 28-Sep-2017
Every large population has a fraction who are morally depraved and commit criminal acts.

In America we call them "democrats."

Is a large number of google hits evidence?

In North Korea and Iran there are few or no 'Google hits' criticizing Kim Yung Poon and the Ayatollah.  That's because their people censored.  So the lack of Google hits in those places are evidence of a lack of freedom.

So, yes, Google hits can be evidence.   

And Google hits concerning a hurricane can be used to make some inferences about a storm brewing. 

It all depends on what one is seeking to prove.
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: sosednik on 00:46 29-Sep-2017
For people who have VERY literal minds:

Are millions of results for a phrase on google, evidence that the phrase corresponds to fact?
___________________________________

In America, many of us call the fraction who are morally depraved and commit criminal acts "attorneys at law."
___________________________________

Since Reggie loves humor ... a few of my favorite jokes.

Q.  What's the difference between a dead skunk in the middle of the road, and a dead lawyer in the middle of the road?

A.  There are skid marks leading to the skunk's body.
___________________________________

Q.  What's black and brown, and looks good on a lawyer?

A.  A Rotweiler.
___________________________________

Q.  Why does California have more lawyers than any other US state, whereas New Jersey has more "superfund" toxic waste sites than any other US state?

A.  New Jersey got the first pick.
___________________________________

A man was waiting in a long line in the bank, when he was startled to feel the strong grip of someone massaging his shoulders.  He angrily whirled around to confront the man behind him:  "hey, what the hell are you doing?"  The other man said, "I'm a massage therapist, and I could see from your posture that you're carrying a lot of muscle tension in your neck and shoulders.  I guess it was a professional reflex to massage those tense muscles."  The first man said, "So?  I'm a lawyer.  Do you see me f*cking the guy ahead of me in the a$$?"
___________________________________

A skillful contractor, having finished his time on Earth, was sent to Hell for his sins.  He thought to himself, "this place is terrible" and set to work on improvements.  He improvised air filters to reduce the stink of brimstone, plumbed in air conditioning and running water, and added other comforts.

When Satan learned about this, he was furious.  He tried to deport the contractor to Heaven, but he was again rejected for his sins.  Satan rang God on the phone, and complained:  "This guy is wrecking Hell.  It's getting so comfortable here, souls won't writhe in eternal torment.  I want you to get this guy out of here."  But God was adamant.

So Satan yelled, "either you get this guy out of here, or I'm going to sue your pants off in court."  God was a bit taken aback, not having been threatened before with litigation.  But he bravely answered, "go ahead, my side will surely win the case!"

To which Satan answered, "Oh yeah?  Where are YOU gonna find a lawyer?"
___________________________________

Because Reggie's an attorney himself, he probably knows some choice lawyer jokes.
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: Paulenko on 05:19 29-Sep-2017
The number of links or sources determines the credibility of the statement that Germany has a refugee problem? a refugees in my opinion can never be a problem. The problem is the war stricken places where human rights are abused and which makes people escape... the problem is not the people trying to escape. all the refugees and migrants were declared a problem mostly by right wing parties and populists who tried to invent someting in order to win votes. according to them the problem is all these illegal criminals and Muslim terrorists, which shatter europe. The solution is blocking the borders, throw all illegal  migrants out immediately and stick to the pure blood of our nation..... The Nazis tried to tell Germans the same by the way. That is a problem in my opinion....

First off, I'd agree with you if you said that on an ethical level, genuine refugees can never be a problem. However, Germany let in almost a million refugees into their country in 2015! That is a huge number of people to accept into Germany in such a short period of time. Such a huge number of refugees allowed in from say countries like France or Poland would cause huge social problems in Germany, let alone letting people in people from Syria, who have totally different values and different ways of looking at life(well at least most of them do). I mean putting cultural values and outlook to one side, just the sheer volume of refugees into Germany caused trouble within the country. These people needed housing, feeding and then integrating all at the expense of the tax payer, lets face it. Most of these refugees weren't even fully vetted before they were allowed into Germany. They come from a war torn country, where the concept of jihad is regularly spoken about in many of their mosques. Where half the country has been taken over by Islamic extremists. I am not fear mongering here, but don't you think there would of been numerous Jihadis let in out of the 1 million refugees let into Germany in 2015, given that most of them were from Syria and other muslim countries such as Iraq.

Now I am sure that most of these refugees were/are not terrorists, but there will also be a large portion with a very different outlook on life to Westerners. As we saw ourselves, many do not know how to behave properly, especially in front of German women. Many of them might not of been terrorists, but another portion of them would of been criminals. Germany weren't only letting in the educated and skilled Syrians were they, they let in everyone who came in the direction of Germany who happened to be Syrian, as well as some from other countries. Many would of pretended to be Syrian as well, Arabic is spoken in North Africa, Iraq and other countries. So I'd imagine a change in accent/dialect to claim Syrian origin, wouldn't be that hard for those who threw away their passports. So a lot of economic migrants would of been let in. In any case, Germany was not their first port of call, so why didn't these refugees stick to the rules and stay in the first countries of safety that they reached? What's wrong with Turkey, Jordan, Lebanon and Egypt? I won't even start to talk about the wealthy GCC States who were only willing to take in a handful of Syrians at best.

At the end of the day, it is very noble to be altruistic in such a way, which on face value seems to be how Merkel behaved. But in reality, there are many other social problems that were created by letting in so many refugees into Germany. Not only did crime rates rise exponentially, but there was an obvious strain on the economy, as well as tensions created between the refugees and some of the locals. I am sure the right wing parties had a field day exacerbating the situation with the refugees, but even without these right wing parties, some fundamental problems would of remained, by letting in such a huge amount of people from a very different culture in such a small space of time.

Moreover, where the Germans asked if they were ok with letting so many refugees into Germany? I think there should of been a vote. If there was a vote, I am sure the majority of Germans would not of been happy letting in a million refugees in 2015. Hey, but maybe I am wrong, after all Merkel and her policies seem to be very popular in Germany. Hence the reason she has been elected many times as Chancellor and she is now in her 4th term in office. A very impressive record to have as a politician I would of thought. But I will never be convinced that letting in a million immigrants into a single country in the space of year, won't cause significant problems, especially considering the manner in which they were let in. Furthermore, Germany is not a huge country, it is not Russia we are talking about, letting in all those people into a country the size of Germany was always going to create some social problems. I am not suggesting that Germany should of taken the stance of Poland, Hungary, Czechia and Slovakia for example and not let any of the Syrians(and other refugees/immigrants) in. All I am suggesting is that they shouldn't have taken in as many as they did. More importantly, the vetting process should of been more strictly regulated and it should of been much more thorough.
Title: Re: Angela Merkel Wins, but Implications for Ukraine
Post by: David Rochlin on 05:50 29-Sep-2017
A very large number of even the children among the "Migrants" are former soldiers.   The realities U.N. camps in Syria were  that those camps were not very safe and most of the refugees who stayed in them either could protect themselves, or had men with them who could do that.  The same goes for groups smuggled to Europe by boat or land routes.  U.N camps in Syria are not for the meek, and very dangerous for any religious minorities, Christians especially.  Consequently, many who made it to the West really went through the reverse of vetting and literally faught their way to the front of the queue.